Ideas on how to improve the music

[Byakhiam]

Rather than let these ideas be buried within the awfully negative "slimelight is dying" thread, I'm going to start a new thread on how specifically the music being played could be better. One of the main problems with the music these days is that it is too samey, both in terms of a lot of same songs being played from one week to another, and in terms of most of the music being played being lacking in variety.

I'll start with one of the main causes of lack of variety, namely the significant increase in harshness of the music. On the middle floor over half of the music played these days tends to be near-noise and harsh EBM, and at worst it goes into real noise like Xotox or This Morn' Omina. The hardening of the middle floor seems to have happened when the top floor ceased to play anything softer or more melodic than Noisuf-X or SAM, and the fans of harsh EBM moved to the middle floor. But also when the DJ selection on the top floor ceased to have people who would play anything else than noise on a regular basis. While it was a valid complaint at the time that both floors played similar music sometimes at the same time (or even the same tracks), the "average" music of both floors was definitely different, and if the DJ running order would have been organised along the lines of what they played, there would have been little to no overlap. In addition to the harsh EBM being moved downstairs, the other main hardening factor of the middle floor is that Simon & Steve want to play the new noise-EBM crossbreed that has been really developing into its own only in the past year, but can't play it on the top, as they don't play there. For people like myself who strongly enjoy harsh EBM and the new noise-EBM, this is all good. But for people who do not want most of the night of harsh music every week, this is pretty bad, as futurepop, synthpop and darkwave all have been screwed over by this.

Second and probably even more important point about lack of variety is the near-total absence of modern guitar-based goth/industrial. Namely, modern gothic and industrial metal and industrial rock (Deathstars, Within Temptation, Rammstein, The 69 Eyes, Dope Stars Inc., Marilyn Manson, Unheilig, Mindless Self Indulgence, Kidney Thieves, Lacuna Coil etc). There are occasionally gigs at Elektrowerkz for this sort of music, like the Dope Stars Inc. gig a while back, but in the music being played during Slimelight this sort of music is almost completely absent. While some might say it's "kiddies" music, a sad reality of the scene is that this "kiddies" music is what people at large, even many alternative people, think that gothic and industrial music is. When large alternative magazines write about gothic or industrial bands, they are writing about bands like them, not about Covenant or Combichrist. And people liking that sort of music are unlikely to be thrilled to come to the premier gothic-industrial club in UK and get slapped on the face with the 'reality' that their favourite music is "kiddies music" that doesn't get played at the club. This is probably the worst possible thing that could be done for the club, as it is strangling the future of the club, the influx of new young people. The purist fans of trad goth and old-school industrial are only going to get older, and expecting young people to have same enthusiasm for bands that stopped touring before they were born is pretty arrogant. Both are valid and important parts of the scene, but young people of today tend to see them as just parts of this eclectic and varied scene, rather than raise them on a pedestal for worship.

After addressing the key points regarding to lack of musical variety, I would like to raise some points about the music being the same from week to week. There is an extent to which the customers want to dance to familiar songs every week, but overdoing it in a vain attempt to "keep the floor busy" is very short-sighted style of DJ:ing. I would not like to start publicly "slagging off" particular DJs, but I'm sure that most regular visitors in Slimelight know that some DJs are far more predictable than others. If the Slimelight management wants to hear open and detailed criticism on specific DJs, just let me know and I can send it by email. For now I'll just say that when a DJ comes on who plays 80+% same songs that he/she played the previous week he/she played, I leave the floor. Despite that I used to love dancing to those songs.

In regards to the music being "samey", there is a noticeable problem within the scene that Slimes DJs can't really do anything about. Namely that the "lead" bands of the EBM scene (Covenant, VNV, Apop) are all making non-club friendly synthpop and the rest of the scene is following them. It makes sense for the named three bands to want to change their style rather than keep doing the same thing over and over again, but the knock-on effect of a lack of good futurepop being released is making it harder for DJs to play new good music, unless it's really harsh stuff. If you think about it, the 2000-2002 period, when the three named bands released most of their best material, coincides with the emerging of the cybergoth sub-culture, from where most of the young people coming to Slimes in the 21st century hail from. So it would strike me as very logical that the cybergoths came to Slimelight because of the futurepop and techno, neither of which is really played at Slimes that much anymore. The cybers are still out there, but they're (mainly) going to hard dance events instead. This isn't really directly related to the music in Slimes, but it's something that should be kept in mind when thinking of how to form the music policy.

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Continued in next post.

[Byakhiam]

And this brings us to the actual ideas on how the overall music policy of Slimes could work better:

Two floor ideas:

Guitars vs Electronics:
- Floor 1, Guitar-driven floor: Trad goth, other gothic rock, industrial rock, industrial metal .. a bit like current trad floor, but having only 50% trad goth and then other 50% of music in style of the second point above
- Floor 2, Electronic floor: EBM, noise, synthpop, darkwave .. bit hard to make all work together, but going from Diary of Dreams to Terrorfakt is possible within a set if the DJ knows his music well enough
- Why it would work? Because guitar-driven music fits in together with other guitar-driven music far better than say industrial rock with electronic industrial like EBM or noise.

Gothic vs Industrial:
- Floor 1, Gothic floor: Trad goth, darkwave, synthpop, soft EBM, gothic metal .. basically any sort of music that identifies with "gothic" in mood while incorporating multiple styles that evoke that mood to keep the floor varied and fit in all sorts of music that make the scene
- Floor 2, Industrial floor: Harsh EBM, noise, industrial rock & metal, old school industrial .. basically any sort of music that identifies with "industrial" in mood while incorporating multiple styles that evoke that mood to keep the floor varied and fit in all sorts of music that make the scene
- Why it would work? If the DJs play varied sets that keep the atmosphere of the floor without playing any particular style of gothic / industrial too long (longer than a few songs in a row) and without doing too awkward jumps in styles, the music can flow together into a single consistent continuum. More challenging for the DJs than the previous option though.

Ideally however there would be three floors .. some ideas for it:

Guitars vs Soft Electronics vs Hard Electronics:
- Floor 1, Guitar-driven floor: Trad goth, other gothic rock, industrial rock, industrial metal .. a bit like current trad floor, but having only 50% trad goth and then other 50% of music in style of the second point above
- Floor 2, Soft electronic floor: Darkwave, synthpop, soft EBM .. basically anything from Cruxshadows and Diary of Dreams through Depeche Mode into VNV Nation
- Floor 3, Hard electronic floor: Harsh EBM, noise-EBM, noise .. basically anything harder electronic than VNV Nation
- Why it would work? It used to work before

Old vs New vs Established:
- Floor 1, Old School Floor: Trad goth, 80s, darkwave, old school industrial .. basically all sorts of music made before 1995 or so that appeal to scene veterans
- Floor 2, New School Floor: Industrial rock, industrial metal, gothic metal, new gothic rock .. basically a floor for current "mainstream" gothic/industrial music, but with also playing some old gothic and industrial rock classic bands (like NIN & Sisters) to allow people to cross over to floor 1, but also playing some Combichrist and other new music that is basically industrial rock/metal without guitars to allow people to cross over to floor 3
Floor 3, Established Floor: EBM, noise-EBM, noise .. basically current middle floor without any old school industrial or 80s, and including a bit more noise to compensate for taking out noise floor
- Why it would work? Because the music on floors 1 and 2 would work together through them being familiar to their target audiences and floor 3 keeping the old regulars happy (except for narrow-minded noise people)

Gothic vs Industrial vs Weekly Specials:
- Two floors essentially same as 2 floor Gothic vs Industrial, so I won't copy/paste that
- Third floor with a changing theme every week: 1 week old school industrial, 1 week trad goth, 1 week noise assault and 1 week whole night of EBM .... these as examples that I think could work and then obviously the other floors would need to adjust their music selection based on the special to avoid overlap
- Why it would work? It would directly fight against the "same thing every week" syndrome that plagues Slimelight and it would give all sorts of narrow-minded people their "ideal night" once a month .. also the same reasons as for two floor gothic vs industrial

A musical overhaul like any of the above would require some work though. First of all, incorporating "new school" industrial rock/metal and gothic metal would require new DJs to play it. And not any crappy Inferno DJs, but dynamic younger (below 40) people who are genuinely into those kinds of music. Vicky can probably play them too, but just one DJ isn't quite enough there. Otherwise the established DJs can probably play most of the genres listed .. except if the "monthly specials" are implemented, when guest DJs of those styles should be brought in to bring more variety. Secondly, a musical overhaul would need to be advertised properly. Especially if it is to target younger people who have not heard of Slimelight or have only heard how it is "used" to be. Word of mouth is fairly useful method of advertising, but relying solely on that is not really that practical today, especially when there are people around who use the same channels to spread anti-Slimelight sentiment to the scene.

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Finally though and slightly contradicting the previous paragraph ... it would be an idea to regularly bring in guest DJs to play a set or two a night. A guest DJ would be likely to play a bit different sort of set than the regulars which would be good for variety. Also a guest DJ, who's got some name to him/herself would probably try to get all his/her mates to come down too. Also if it wouldn't seem like such an impossible prospect to play at Slimes, I'd expect the appeal of starting new goth/industrial club nights left and right would be significantly lesser. Ultimately, a guest DJ playing an hour or two is at worst an hour or two of bad music one Saturday, while the potential benefits could be significant.

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Opinions? Feedback? Your own ideas?

[Dr_absinthe]

I'm just going to respond to the night suggestions for now and get around to the rest of it later.

I've said this to you before and I'll say it again. An idea can only be considered as valid if it comes from a non-biased perspective and as far as I can tell you haven't offered any neutral justification for the floor plans you have outlined.

The music policy is gradually changing on the top floor anyway with far less noise being being played to make way for more harsh techno/trance. Before anything is changed surely this format should be given a chance. I notice that neither of these two types of music are listed by you anywhere and should certainly be taken into consideration.

These are my responses to your suggestions. First from my perspective and then from a neutral standpoint... or at least as neutral as I can be!

Guitars Vs Electronics
My perspective - If this was implemented it would be the last time I came to the club unless something special was planned.
Neutral standpoint - Whilst the guitar floor would flow nicely there is a major disparity on the electronic floor. The range of music is too vast and would lead to largely incoherent sets and too much standing around.

Gothic Vs Industrial
My perspective - Impossible to play a set that would flow nicely on the industrial floor, too many enormous beat jumps which I hate.
Neutral standpoint - Probably the closest suggestion to being fair. A half-decent mix of music although I can see there being more arguments about music than there are at the moment. Some people like coherent, beat-matched sets and a certain level of repetition, others like random, staccato beats. It would be each side calling the other side 'rubbish' constantly.

Guitars vs Soft Electronics vs Hard Electronics
My perspective - This is basically what we used to have on three floor nights, only with a worse top floor policy. What you consider harsh and what I consider harsh are two very different things.
Neutral standpoint - Lose 'harsh-EBM' for other options such as harsh techno/IDM. They don't get a huge exposure and would probably bring the cyber crowd flooding back. Other two floors seem quite well balanced though.

Old vs New vs Established
My perspective - Far too much synthy nonsense to keep me entertained for more than two sets.
Neutral standpoint - Far too much emphasis and similarity on the first two floors and far too much disparity on the top floor. On the plus side the bar and smoking areas would be packed as people would be dancing for 15 minutes at a time and then giving up because of the shift in music.

Gothic vs Industrial vs Weekly Specials
My perspective - Much better than the Gothic Vs Industrial suggestion as the music balance is now leveled out. I would probably come as regularly as I do now, (every other weekend)
Neutral standpoint - It would help to level out the music by having dedicated nights and would probably create a lot less arguments. It's the best suggestion you've had.

Unfortunately, until we can be absolutely certain that there will be a third floor again the last three are hardly worth debating. I know the restaurant as it is will only be there for another few months, but who knows what will happen to it after that.

There are more things I would like to say in regards to this topic, but my hand is really giving me some grief so I'll leave it here for the time being. To be continued!

[SlimJim]

Some thoughts from me, not a regular, prefer futurepop, darkwave, hard techno -

Yes I have noticed the hardening on the middle floor. It would keep me away were I a regular, but it just makes me leave early when i do actually go out. In fact I prefer the harder top floor music compared to that and were I alone, would probably spend more time there.

I also think Slimes may be missing something by not having a Goth Metal type night, as reading something like Kerrang, which is full of those bands, it looks like that's what the new/young goth types are listening to.

Ideas? Other than play what I like ;) I don't go often enough to say what should and shouldn't be played.

[Dr_absinthe]

Just a quick thought I had for if/when the third floor is reintroduced. Why not stick to the current format for a month, EBM with industek/goth every other week and use the third floor to experiment with.

If there were some well advertised 'specials' it would be easy to use the interest to gauge what the best way to take the club would be. I'm not talking about the "we're here to support the DJ and have never been to Slimes" crowd but more from the current regulars and hopefully the old regulars who decide to come back to give it a try again.

I'd personally attend every week for a month just to see the reaction!

[Byakhiam]

Absinthe,

Harsh/alternative techno/trance I purposefully left out for a reason. Namely because Slimelight is supposed to be a gothic/industrial club, so those types of music should be given priority. I like a fair bit of techno and trance, especially since I've lately been expanding my own taste into those genres due to the format of the club/party I've been organising myself (see sig).

And surely that sort of music would be nice as a bit of variety, but I think something would have gone wrong, if one of the floors could be described as "hard dance" floor ... especially if it means not playing established industrial music.

--

And yes, I know that all my suggestions screw over noise / industek .. but introducing a whole new section of music (gothic/industrial rock/metal) without adding a new floor just has to screw over something being played at the moment. And noise / industek is the least popular sort of music in Slimes at the moment, so it makes logical sense to screw that over rather than something else.

With adding a third floor, things are easier to manage around. And there are more options for three floors to work than what I outlined ... getting a proper debate started is the important bit. :)

[Dr_absinthe]

Absinthe,

Harsh/alternative techno/trance I purposefully left out for a reason. Namely because Slimelight is supposed to be a gothic/industrial club, so those types of music should be given priority.

The music I'm referring to has a very solid industrial founding, it's just been taken a different way. Check out acts like Omkara Techichi and Ophidian and tell me they don't deserve a play in Slimelight. If Delirium can have play time then these guys really deserve it!

And surely that sort of music would be nice as a bit of variety, but I think something would have gone wrong, if one of the floors could be described as "hard dance" floor ... especially if it means not playing established industrial music.

It is nice to have a bit of variety which is why I never said at any point that these styles should be the main focus of the music selection, just that the current format needs a while to see if it works.

And yes, I know that all my suggestions screw over noise / industek .. but introducing a whole new section of music (gothic/industrial rock/metal) without adding a new floor just has to screw over something being played at the moment. And noise / industek is the least popular sort of music in Slimes at the moment, so it makes logical sense to screw that over rather than something else.

I have a few problems with this. The main thing this does is screw over the better DJ's in the club. Anyone can mix synths together, it's not hard. Anyone can play the end of one track into the start of another, you just need Itunes for that. Where does this option leave people like Dwellems, who practices for hours and finds so many new tunes to blend into one massively coherent set. Pete who is imho the best damn Dj in Slimelight. Untermensch, Uwe, Mak and Francesca... sure, they can all adapt to new styles and jump from 120bpm to 180 in the blink of an eye, but why should their best sets have to suffer because of what one person thinks?

Before you say anything about the current poll at the top of this, I can see clearly that further people have agreed with you, but without putting forward any sort of structured debate, reason or rhyme for their vote I consider them null and void. If this was an election, fair enough, it's actually a public forum. I've also noticed that a few people have voted the same way as me, referring to a post, which surprises me as so far there are only three of us posting in this thread. Anyway, that's all by the by.

Different music always has to be brought in to keep things interesting, that's a given. However, the day that metal is introduced into Slimes is the day I stop turning up. One or two tracks are fine, anything more than that is dangerous for more reasons than one. They are not reasons I will bring up in public, ask me about them next time we're in Slimes.

Anyway, never having been to a goth night I don't know how many people turn up, I can only say that the Industek has been doing much better recently. There was a low ebb a few months back but each fortnight I return, numbers seem to be increasing again.

By the time the third floor is back into the equation maybe we'll have a better idea.

[Byakhiam]

The music I'm referring to has a very solid industrial founding, it's just been taken a different way. Check out acts like Omkara Techichi and Ophidian and tell me they don't deserve a play in Slimelight. If Delirium can have play time then these guys really deserve it!

I complain to the DJ (except not to Mak) every time Delirium is played ... and it's requested by a number of people every week.

Also, sure gabber has industrial roots like a lot of techno ... but gabber is still not industrial. Sure you could have darkcore / IDM / gabber at a special occasion, but as a regular music it's more suited to Bangface or one of the numerous London clubs playing hardcore than Slimelight.

It is nice to have a bit of variety which is why I never said at any point that these styles should be the main focus of the music selection, just that the current format needs a while to see if it works.

Maybe ... but personally I think things need to be shaken up properly after how bad things got on the industek floor last year. But ultimately I wouldn't mind having the industek floor still there in its current format, if there wouldn't be a need for a dancefloor something else.

I have a few problems with this. The main thing this does is screw over the better DJ's in the club. Anyone can mix synths together, it's not hard. Anyone can play the end of one track into the start of another, you just need Itunes for that. Where does this option leave people like Dwellems, who practices for hours and finds so many new tunes to blend into one massively coherent set. Pete who is imho the best damn Dj in Slimelight. Untermensch, Uwe, Mak and Francesca... sure, they can all adapt to new styles and jump from 120bpm to 180 in the blink of an eye, but why should their best sets have to suffer because of what one person thinks?

They may be technically superior, but what's superior mixing good for if nobody wants to hear the tunes?

Different music always has to be brought in to keep things interesting, that's a given. However, the day that metal is introduced into Slimes is the day I stop turning up. One or two tracks are fine, anything more than that is dangerous for more reasons than one. They are not reasons I will bring up in public, ask me about them next time we're in Slimes.

With no offense to you, but if we'd have to swap you at the club for two hundred young goths at the club, I'd take the young goths any day. ;)

And please elaborate why metal is so bad? Do note I'm not talking about Iron Maiden or Metallica here, but the types of metal that are an accepted part of the gothic/industrial scene and even which bands play pre-Slimes gigs and at festivals like WGT. Don't get me wrong, I don't want a massive influx of drunk violent hardcore metal-heads in Slimes either, just the current generation of young people who self-identify themselves as goths, but don't see Slimes as offering much for them at the moment.

Anyway, never having been to a goth night I don't know how many people turn up, I can only say that the Industek has been doing much better recently. There was a low ebb a few months back but each fortnight I return, numbers seem to be increasing again.

I can assure you that on average the goth floor is busier than the industek floor. I walk through them both several times a night and occasionally stay to dance for a few songs. But I'm a middle-floorer, so I can't give approximates on how the night goes on the whole.

Personally I'd say that the goth floor requires those guest DJs I detailed in the initial posts most urgently, since there's basically only two DJs on that floor.

By the time the third floor is back into the equation maybe we'll have a better idea.

Yes, getting the third floor back will make things a lot better. :)

[Dr_absinthe]

Also, sure gabber has industrial roots like a lot of techno ... but gabber is still not industrial. Sure you could have darkcore / IDM / gabber at a special occasion, but as a regular music it's more suited to Bangface or one of the numerous London clubs playing hardcore than Slimelight.

That is certainly the place for gabber to be played. I'm not talking about gabber though, I'm talking about Industrial Techno which is a completely different thing.

They may be technically superior, but what's superior mixing good for if nobody wants to hear the tunes?

Because, much like myself, a lot of people want to hear a properly mixed set. Many people who go to Slimelight will, at some point, have tried their hands at mixing music and will certainly know a well constructed set. The worst thing in the world is having to stop and start all night because someone can't tell which two tracks go together.

With no offense to you, but if we'd have to swap you at the club for two hundred young goths at the club, I'd take the young goths any day.

And please elaborate why metal is so bad? Do note I'm not talking about Iron Maiden or Metallica here, but the types of metal that are an accepted part of the gothic/industrial scene and even which bands play pre-Slimes gigs and at festivals like WGT. Don't get me wrong, I don't want a massive influx of drunk violent hardcore metal-heads in Slimes either, just the current generation of young people who self-identify themselves as goths, but don't see Slimes as offering much for them at the moment.

If you prefer to socialise with drunken teenagers then that is your prerogative. Personally I'd prefer to be in a place that isn't populated by fifteen year old inebriates.

I'll give you one reason that metal is bad, the rest are staying with me for the time being. I hate people tapping me on the shoulder just to talk when I'm dancing. The last thing I want is a DJ thinking "I'll chuck a tune on for the kids, RATM will be fun" and getting them to bounce around and push each other about. The first person who bounded into me on the dancefloor would be painfully reminded not to do it again. There are reasons I choose not to go to clubs where that sort of music is played and that is one of them.

Once you appeal to the lowest common denominator you end up with a fickle crowd who have no loyalty. All of the regulars have disappeared and won't want to come back and the children have moved on to the next thing that offers cheap booze and bad music.

[Byakhiam]

That is certainly the place for gabber to be played. I'm not talking about gabber though, I'm talking about Industrial Techno which is a completely different thing.

Industrial Techno or Industrial Hardcore? From what I've heard from them, for example both Ophidian and Omkara Techichi are basically a cross-over of noise and gabber.

Because, much like myself, a lot of people want to hear a properly mixed set. Many people who go to Slimelight will, at some point, have tried their hands at mixing music and will certainly know a well constructed set. The worst thing in the world is having to stop and start all night because someone can't tell which two tracks go together.

Oh, I certainly enjoy a set that flows as well. I have often complained to the DJs in person when they have played some weird mixes like going from 140 BPM harsh EBM into 110 BPM synthpop. But you're trying to give an impression here that nobody who doesn't play on the top floor has any idea what-so-ever on DJ:ing. ;)

Ultimately, most sets on the middle floor flow very well and for me are far more enjoyable to listen to, because they actually contain interesting tunes.

If you prefer to socialise with drunken teenagers then that is your prerogative. Personally I'd prefer to be in a place that isn't populated by fifteen year old inebriates.

I'll give you one reason that metal is bad, the rest are staying with me for the time being. I hate people tapping me on the shoulder just to talk when I'm dancing. The last thing I want is a DJ thinking "I'll chuck a tune on for the kids, RATM will be fun" and getting them to bounce around and push each other about. The first person who bounded into me on the dancefloor would be painfully reminded not to do it again. There are reasons I choose not to go to clubs where that sort of music is played and that is one of them.

Once you appeal to the lowest common denominator you end up with a fickle crowd who have no loyalty. All of the regulars have disappeared and won't want to come back and the children have moved on to the next thing that offers cheap booze and bad music.

Really now, just listen to yourself, this is being simply arrogant. :p

[Dr_absinthe]

Industrial Techno or Industrial Hardcore? From what I've heard from them, for example both Ophidian and Omkara Techichi are basically a cross-over of noise and gabber.

Listen to more Gabber is the best advice I can give you.

Oh, I certainly enjoy a set that flows as well. I have often complained to the DJs in person when they have played some weird mixes like going from 140 BPM harsh EBM into 110 BPM synthpop. But you're trying to give an impression here that nobody who doesn't play on the top floor has any idea what-so-ever on DJ:ing.

Ultimately, most sets on the middle floor flow very well and for me are far more enjoyable to listen to, because they actually contain interesting tunes.

I certainly hope I'm not giving that impression as I doubt the middle floor Dj's would have been playing as long as they have if they were useless. As for playing interesting tunes however, I can't agree. This is my personal opinion but I don't find a majority of the music played on the middle floor interesting at all. I would much rather listen to some good rhythmic noise or a well beat-matched set any day.

Really now, just listen to yourself, this is being simply arrogant.

Exactly how did I exaggerate my own self worth in that post? Was I being overbearing? I certainly don't think so.

Anyway, I'm offering my opinion based on personal experience, I'm not forcing it on you. If you choose to disagree then you choose to disagree. At least have the decency to respond eloquently as opposed to just trying to score cheap points.

[CIW]

The first person who bounded into me on the dancefloor would be painfully reminded not to do it again. There are reasons I choose not to go to clubs where that sort of music is played and that is one of them.

Sheesh, just punch them...

Last time someone bounced into me like that during stupid "nu-metal" crap, well, he ended up with broken nose, blood all over the place, and then being kicked out because he became aggressive due to that, lulz :D (Rock @ Mean Fiddler, 2006 or 2007)

I think the numbers thing is different perception, I usually count more people upstairs during
Industek nights, while Tap counts more during Goff nights.

Bet we can agree though that both of them picked up again more recently.

In all other points though I'd side / agree with the green man absinthe.
Details I might post later today or tomorrow (if I cba)

[dwellems]

I'm itching to say something on this hot topic but I will not, even when stuff has been said already about topfloor DJ's...
I've had my say already and now I'm reading this thread with the keenest of interests to it's out come...
So come-on all members have your say by posting something and vote!

[BeElZeBabe]

Now, most of you know that I prefer to lurk on the forum and have a giggle at the silliness and catch up on what I have missed but this has grated on my nerves some what so feel the need to actually say something on the matter. Now every so often I log on to see that things need to be changed that slimes is dying…. Then there are arguments for and against change and to be honest it all gets very tedious very quickly. Yes it has been quiet recently… but do people actually consider that the weather has a part to play in people not venturing out? Or perhaps us all being broke after xmas? January and February are notoriously slow months for the pub trade, having worked in that sector for most of my working life it’s obvious to me where everyone is.
As for the music….-sighs- music is all to do with personal taste, and in that vein I love the top floor, yes I can be amused by the middle floor temporarily but I would much rather be on the top floor. All of the top floor DJ’s play the best sets…. Since they are what I would personally call sets not just one song after another, and I personally have no wish to stifle anyone’s creativity and inspiration, knowing full well how hard several DJ’s work to give people the best night possible. Hunting for new music, practising mixes etc.
Changing the format of the whole of Slimes…. Many have tried to come up with ideas to “improve” things over the years. But from what I have seen over the last few months it has basically been Byakhiam that has been unhappy with things and trying to effect some kind of change so that he is happier with the place, now as far as I am aware he has his own “club night” to contend with and perhaps, just perhaps he should implement these ideas and utilise all this creative energy with his night instead of playing with a formula that has so obviously worked for 21 years, and perhaps realise that the more you complain about something the less people will actually listen and eventually you become the butt of on going jokes.
Adding metal into the mixture is imho a terrible idea! I have worked in many “metal” pubs and have seen some of the most horrific fights, attitudes and basically blood baths in those places over the years and the amount of statements I have had to give to the police have given me some insight into that matter.

But then what is the point of me offering my opinion when insults have already begun to be banded about. Does that not defeat the whole purpose of an open discussion?

[mr_laughing_boy]

This may sound bloomin' obvious, but if any of the aforementioned changes are going to happen, there will be alot of people who don't like them. And when push comes to shove, they may even stop coming.

But in my oppinion that pails in significance to the fact that unless something is done Slimelight may die a slow and painful death.

I may not be a regular (Although that will soon change when i move to London) but even since 2007 when i first went to Slimelight, even I have noticed a drastic change in the quality of music, and also, the number of people that come.

One idea that I did have, probably not possible, certainly not now that they have moved it, but when the smoking area was in the large court yard, they could have done something really interesting with that. Even if they just used it as an experimental area to find out what people want. All it would have taken was some patio heaters....

[Byakhiam]

First, why I'm talking about metal... I've got negative experiences with metal-heads too, but I also know quite a few good people who like industrial/gothic metal. Also I've been to a Within Temptation/69 Eyes gig in '07, which had far more people in there than Covenant or Combichrist ever have had. Reasonable sort of people, and mostly goths. There wasn't fighting, pushing/shoving or other 'unpleasant' behaviour. Additionally I have been to Inferno, which is the premier place for gothic/industrial metal in London (and that is very telling on how little people liking that sort of music have got to choose from :p ), and the only types that seem to cause trouble there are either non-alternative types or obvious fans of other sorts of metal (like death metal) .... And despite me expressly specifying that only certain types of metal should be played, everyone is just simply assuming that it would still draw in hordes of teenager nu-metal types or those violent extreme metal types. -- This is exactly what I was saying in my initial post, that this whole sub-genre of music is disregarded as "unwanted" music, with a variety of excuses.

Then people saying it's just me against the rest ... or that I'm trying to change the club to suit my own desires. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm almost completely satisfied with the middle floor in its current state. I don't personally particularly like gothic/industrial metal either. Personally I mainly stand to lose out if things are changed around in the club. Except in that one key regard, mentioned also by Mr Laughing Boy, that if the club dies a slow and painful death, everyone loses out, including myself. To prevent that is my only motivation in trying to change things.

@CIW, the numbers present on the top floor through the night vary a lot more during Industek night, since people move between floors. While most of the time during a goth night, the people more or less stick to one floor. So, I personally tend to count how many different faces I see, and I tend to find that during a goth night there's more around. However, hard statistics on this are held by Slimes staff, so the management knows which type of top floor pulls a better crowd.

@BeElZeBabe, obviously every club has ups and downs ... but you're completely wrong in the times you're looking at. Late January had some of the busiest non-band nights in months, despite bad weather, despite everyone being broke. The reason why I'm talking about this is that most of the last year, especially when Industek used to be weekly event, there used to be one busy floor and one empty floor in Slimes. At worst there were like five people a night on the top floor. Compare this to 2005 or 2006, when top floor was packed almost every week, despite weather or it being end of the month. Hell, when I started going Slimes in 2005, the top floor was the busier floor of the two. So, I think there's some validity to speak about things having gone downhill within the past year or two.

[Skarik]

My eyes are growing heavy reading all of this so I shall reply generally.

I believe Dr Absinthe brushed upon the subject: The main 'cause' for all of this is the closing of the bottom floor. I've only been going to Slimes for two years now.

For me, the top floor 'should' be noize, experimental electronic, gabber, and hard dance etc. That's how it was when I started: pounding electronic music that was possible to dance to for the entire night without having to stop; excellent mixing and interesting arrangements being the key factor in making this possible!

The middle floor always used to be where I went if my ears/head needed a little rest. Classic EBM, synthpop and futurepop, and some harsh EBM (R.I.P the playing of "Chains of Love"...*sob* :( lol)

Now, as I'm sure we remember, it wasn't always three floor Slimes! There was many a week without the goth floor. But when it was open, it did 'fill in the gap', as it were. Avoiding the overly played industrial metal that all 'Alternative Clubs' seem to play, the metal you'd occasionally hear there would be nice to hear, in my opinion, as you wouldn't hear it anywhere else!

(And of course, there was the nights when 'experimental' was played in the downstairs bar, and three-floors meant the cinema step-area too... *longing sigh*...)

Alas we lost the bottom floor, which meant the club has to cater for the tastes of more musical styles than it can handle on a single night. Despite the initial talk of "It'll be back next year", I've heard otherwise; as far as I know, the bottom floor is gone.

Now....I'm not sure what to make of the rumours, but the word on the grapevine about those two extra floors being opened upstairs will be brilliant if they turn out to be true. I notice Byakhiam that none of your suggestions were for 4 floors ;-P That would solve all problems...

Now the topic of lots of metal being played at Slimes... I love industrial metal, it's how I eventually got into industrial and EBM in the first place. The thing is, I'm not sure I'd like Slimes to start playing lots of it. Mix it in with other guitar music in the club, sure, that's still sometimes done on the top floor. But the crowd that LOTS of metal would draw will more than likely have a negative effect on the club as, as mentioned by others in this thread, current regulars will probably not like it and might stop going.

Interesting thread, this one.... I'm still hanging on to see what happens about these 'extra floor' rumours.... Or have I missed something and theyre not rumours at all, but open plans?!

[BeElZeBabe]

Well as far as I am aware we’re still in February, so my time scale is not as off as you seem to insinuate, yes the times I made it to slimes despite the snow where reasonably busy, but not everyone has the cash to come every week at the moment, and some of us choose not to go every week simply because of the change in music week to week, back in 94 when I first started going to slimes regularly thing where very different and there have always been fluctuations in attendance. Quiet periods, they have come before and will happen again.

[Silversurfer]

DriveHQ.com Monthly Statement for Username: Dwellems, Max Nolan
Account type: Paid Account, Closing Date: 1/20/2009

Account Balances and Summary

File space:
1.87GB
Max storage space:
3.00GB
Message Space:
16 KB
Download bytes last month:
6.51GB
Max monthly download bytes:
9.00GB
Total number of orders:
1
Total number of transactions:
1
Total amount of Transactions:
$93.35
Total points earned:
12

Downloads as follows..

- slimes set 16Nov 08 mp3 (http://www.drivehq.com/sharing/SetPermission.aspx?action=load&ShareID=5186459)- slimes set 16Nov 08.mp3
618 downloads
slimes set (http://www.drivehq.com/sharing/SetPermission.aspx?action=load&ShareID=5189826)- Hive Mind Assalt - Return to the Hive Part I.mp3 Publish
257 downloads
Remixed by Dwellems (http://www.drivehq.com/sharing/SetPermission.aspx?action=load&ShareID=5210385)Remixed by Dwellems - Slimes set 3rd Jan 2009 5 - 6.mp3 Publish
167 downloads

Return to the Hive Part II (http://www.drivehq.com/sharing/SetPermission.aspx?action=load&ShareID=5232442)- Hive Mind Assalt - Return to the Hive Part II.mp3Publish
258 downloads

Docplaystraktorpro (http://www.drivehq.com/sharing/SetPermission.aspx?action=load&ShareID=5253582)Docplaystraktorpro.mp3 Publish
168 downloads


This thread tells me how much downloads and interest this thread gets..
Thanks for all your interest

Dose this explain anything to you or is your motives of anther nature??
And before you jump to any conclusions I'm nobodys lilly pet.. ie when a DJ plays shite I have a go at them and they know this..
And as far as your ideas concerning the club...
What a bunch of bollocks!! Leave it alone to the ppl that have been running the club for over 20yrs+ so far..

[CIW]

One idea that I did have, probably not possible, certainly not now that they have moved it, but when the smoking area was in the large court yard, they could have done something really interesting with that. Even if they just used it as an experimental area to find out what people want. All it would have taken was some patio heaters....

If you mean music wise, there would've been nothing possible there, unless you want Islington Council to close that place / revoke its licence ;)

[Byakhiam]

Well as far as I am aware we’re still in February, so my time scale is not as off as you seem to insinuate, yes the times I made it to slimes despite the snow where reasonably busy, but not everyone has the cash to come every week at the moment, and some of us choose not to go every week simply because of the change in music week to week, back in 94 when I first started going to slimes regularly thing where very different and there have always been fluctuations in attendance. Quiet periods, they have come before and will happen again.

But you're not going to tell me that the place has stayed exactly the same since '94 are you? Or that the music has either? Or that the people coming to the place have never tried to give ideas on where the place could go?

[Byakhiam]

Dose this explain anything to you or is your motives of anther nature??
And before you jump to any conclusions I'm nobodys lilly pet.. ie when a DJ plays shite I have a go at them and they know this..
And as far as your ideas concerning the club...
What a bunch of bollocks!! Leave it alone to the ppl that have been running the club for over 20yrs+ so far..

I have no idea what you're on about. :/

[BeElZeBabe]

Byakhaim.....
Did you actually read my post.... even though you quoted it? I shall reitterate for those who need it "back in 94 when I first started going to slimes regularly things where very different "

And I do belive that I never said you could not offer suggestions.... just that the ones that have been offered so far are not the best in MY opinion, that's what this thread was about was it not?

[Byakhiam]

Ok, point taken, I could have read that post with more care. :)

What would you personally do about things BeElZeBabe?

[BeElZeBabe]

Well firstly thank you for the appology, but I really do suggest you read things a little more carefully as it does limit the chances of you making yourself look like an idiot.

Personally I just think things are in a bit of a slump, and time will tell after all the top floor when you first came to slimes was after all basically playing what is now played on the middle floor. Things change and evolve constantly and slimes is a creature in it's own right. Yes ideas are all well and good, but the formula of perpetual chaos has seemed to work thus far. The powers that be will come up with something if they feel the need to.

[Blink]

Where's Flux when you need him, he says things far better than I do.

People commenting on "beat-matching" as if it was the be-all and end-all of music - go to a good beat-matched R'n'B club! The music comes first, beat matching just makes the night flow better. (Not that I am saying it isn't a talent etc etc, but if Dwellems turned his beat-matching skills to R'n'B, he would still clear the dancefloor). Yes I would rather have a DJ who could beat match, but song selection/playing the crowd is more important .

Metallers slam-dancing- over the last few months there have been a fair few idiots on the middle floor doing this anyway, it isn't a metal only thing.

RATM played at Slime - surely you are deliberately trolling by saying that ;)

Now come on kiddies, let's keep some perspective and play nicely.

My 2pence worth - Simon moving from the middle to the top-floor and Loki playing more on the middle floor and getting the music policy over the two floor back to how it was 4 years ago would be a good start. Mak used to play Delerium on the TOP FLOOR as a set closer, back in the good old days.

As for my musical tastes - I hate goth, and don't like Loki's sets, but think he should come back. I like Simon's sets but think it gets too samey when he and Steve are in that sort of mood. and I have never heard Dwellems play because I stopped visiting the top floor about a year - 2 years ago when it descended in to various forms of (to my ears) noise.

Finally, I am not picking on anyone personally, some of my comments are just using sarcasm as a tool.

And I fucking hate getting involved in these things but you guys made me do it.

[Dr_absinthe]

People commenting on "beat-matching" as if it was the be-all and end-all of music - go to a good beat-matched R'n'B club! The music comes first, beat matching just makes the night flow better. (Not that I am saying it isn't a talent etc etc, but if Dwellems turned his beat-matching skills to R'n'B, he would still clear the dancefloor). Yes I would rather have a DJ who could beat match, but song selection/playing the crowd is more important.

Finally, I am not picking on anyone personally, some of my comments are just using sarcasm as a tool.

If you aren't picking on anyone personally, then why would you choose to use a known name when you could've just said 'DJ-X' or anything as generic. You can mention the word 'sarcasm' as much as you like, contrary to popular belief it isn't a get-out for slagging someone off. You've basically called Dwellems a 'dancefloor clearer' but that could only be pure conjecture as you "stopped visiting the top floor about a year - 2 years ago".

I'm going to assume that this post is why you "fucking hate getting involved in these things".

[FallenPed]

Finally though and slightly contradicting the previous paragraph ... it would be an idea to regularly bring in guest DJs to play a set or two a night. A guest DJ would be likely to play a bit different sort of set than the regulars which would be good for variety. Also a guest DJ, who's got some name to him/herself would probably try to get all his/her mates to come down too. Also if it wouldn't seem like such an impossible prospect to play at Slimes, I'd expect the appeal of starting new goth/industrial club nights left and right would be significantly lesser. Ultimately, a guest DJ playing an hour or two is at worst an hour or two of bad music one Saturday, while the potential benefits could be significant.


First off, I have chopped most of your post away - so people may have to do what I have done in constructing this post and have a couple of tabs open at the same time.

Guitar v Electronic - I don't think would stand a chance of working, see my next paragraph.

Gothic v Industrial - this is pretty much my understanding of what slimelight should be, but then again I was given a choice of one card or the other. I like your references to moods, which is also more along my way of understanding what I think should and should not be played in slimelight - unfortunately, it is one of the most subjective ideas around.

I like your ideas on guest dj's especially for those like me who don't travel abroad much, as guests from continental Europe's big goth/industrial/noise/cyber/... whatnot... clubs would be interesting. I suppose that my idea of a guest DJ is different to yours. Also, some might argue that a "club show" as used to advertise several of the upcoming weekends, may go some way to fulfilling my drift.


Oh, and referencing another post somewhere else in this thread, before anyone thinks that Byakhiam is the only one complaining on music policy, I would like to stop the general shift towards hard techno/trance. I sense that I will lose this... but then again so long as my first 2 hours on a noisetek night are kept distorted/loud/fast/aggressive, I will be happy. It's just techno/trance is not the same mood as the one that I go to slimelight for.

Then again, perhaps give me a couple of months and I may change my mind on this as listening to an old honeypot roosta, it's quite different. Will probably find tomorrow that a savage is also different.

[Alexander]

I agree with what Tapani has said; it's the same thing I've been arguing for for years. Problem is, having argued for it for years, I know there's a snowball's chance in hell of things actually changing. I have come to accept that Slimelight is just a place where beer is cheap until 7am, some music is played and there's lots of interesting people.

Not much more beyond that. It probably would have shut down years ago if not for the fact that it is still essentially unique in the world of clubbing, just a shame that it's mostly trading on that identity rather than doing something good with it.

[Byakhiam]

Guitar v Electronic - I don't think would stand a chance of working, see my next paragraph.

Gothic v Industrial - this is pretty much my understanding of what slimelight should be, but then again I was given a choice of one card or the other. I like your references to moods, which is also more along my way of understanding what I think should and should not be played in slimelight - unfortunately, it is one of the most subjective ideas around.

I have to say you're not very specific on why they wouldn't work... ;)

I like your ideas on guest dj's especially for those like me who don't travel abroad much, as guests from continental Europe's big goth/industrial/noise/cyber/... whatnot... clubs would be interesting. I suppose that my idea of a guest DJ is different to yours. Also, some might argue that a "club show" as used to advertise several of the upcoming weekends, may go some way to fulfilling my drift.

I'd love to have guest DJs from other significant clubs around the world. It was really interesting to hear Jet from NYC / Vampirefreaks DJ when he did that one weekend last year. Also the only time I've been to Antichrist, the best thing about it were two guest DJs from K17 in Berlin. But bringing in guest DJs from Europe (let alone US) to play sets at Slimes is pretty expensive, so it would be hard to do on a regular basis. However, if any prominent DJs are coming to London anyway, it would be an idea to try to get them play a guest set in Slimes. That's how Jet played in Slimes for example.

But I'm also thinking of guest DJs from other UK-based clubs and/or people with demonstrated talent and enthusiasm. For example I went to Electrocute in Reading in January and the resident DJ Sean Curtis played nice and danceable sets, that had their own flavour different from Slimes residents, while keeping to the same general ideas and styles. Similarly when I went up to the Corporation in Sheffield, their local residents made the night interesting for me with their different selection of bands/tracks to play.

Personally I think this is due to there being both scene-wide 'club hits' (like VNV - Beloved), but also club-specific 'club hits' (like Code 64 - Leaving Earth at Slimes). And this is why going clubbing outside of London occasionally is so interesting, as you get to see those different choices on which bands or what songs from same bands to play. And this is also why I would see guest DJs, even from elsewhere in the UK or even other clubs in London, being a significant asset for Slimes to bring a break into the "same old, same old" feeling.

Finally though, I think it's far better to bring in guest DJs who regularly play at clubs, rather than guest DJs who are in bands. Some people who are in bands, but also like to occasionally DJ, can be good. But generally I find that people who are regular DJs have a far better idea on what people actually like... ;)

[SlimJim]

I'm not exactly a connosieur of top floor music, but, IMHO on both Trad Goth and Industek nights, the music is consistently good (well done to the DJ's)and numbers are increasing.

On the middle floor, OK they don't play stuff I like all the time and the music is variable, but it is usually very busy with people dancing. So is there anything wrong?

All the staff are fantastic, thank you.
There is a good atmosphere and friendly people.

All comments and criticism, as long as it's constructive, can only help to make things better.

[Blink]

If you aren't picking on anyone personally, then why would you choose to use a known name when you could've just said 'DJ-X' or anything as generic. You can mention the word 'sarcasm' as much as you like, contrary to popular belief it isn't a get-out for slagging someone off. You've basically called Dwellems a 'dancefloor clearer' but that could only be pure conjecture as you "stopped visiting the top floor about a year - 2 years ago".

I'm going to assume that this post is why you "fucking hate getting involved in these things".

Ok, so having written a huge rant, deleted it and re-written it....

Dr-Absinthe, please re-read what I have written in the spirit I intended. I do not believe at any point I said Dwellems was a dancefloor clearer , and it certainly wasn't my intention to imply that - I even admitted that I hadn't heard him play

My apologies to Dwellems if it came across as anything otherwise, it was in no way meant as a comment on him as a DJ - I actually think Slimelight needs more DJ's wih his attitude.

Your comment about possibly refering to DJ X is a fair point - I was using Dwellems as an example as I respect what Max does and what he is trying to do and was using sarcasm and irony, admittedly not the best tools on teh internetz.

My point was, and still is, that no matter how techncically good "DJ X" is, if "DJ X" plays the wrong music for the club he is DJ'ing in, he is not a good DJ. When I read comments that suggest people would rather hear a technicaly competent, beat-matched set, than a genre they don't like, I question the statement. Beat-matching, and set-building are all skills that a DJ should have, but aren't as important as song selection, which is what the biggest contention is at the moment. (song selection = genre).

I was highlighting this by reference to a well beat-matched R'n'B set not fitting in at Slime.

Finally, the reason I hate these sort of threads is because

i) They never achieve anything
ii) People always (whether innocently or willfully) misinterpret what other people have written
iii) They always descend in to personal insults.

:D
- this thread has been edited and re-edited to try and read as sensibly as possible to avoid any further misundertandings and I am certainly not trying to comment on anyone personally or get in to any personal arguments. :D

[dwellems]

I'm just replying because of that very negative thread "Slimelight is Dying!"
Slimes is NOT DYING!!

[Dr_absinthe]

Ok, so having written a huge rant, deleted it and re-written it....

Dr-Absinthe, please re-read what I have written in the spirit I intended. I do not believe at any point I said Dwellems was a dancefloor clearer , and it certainly wasn't my intention to imply that - I even admitted that I hadn't heard him play

My apologies to Dwellems if it came across as anything otherwise, it was in no way meant as a comment on him as a DJ - I actually think Slimelight needs more DJ's wih his attitude.

Your comment about possibly refering to DJ X is a fair point - I was using Dwellems as an example as I respect what Max does and what he is trying to do and was using sarcasm and irony, admittedly not the best tools on teh internetz.

My point was, and still is, that no matter how techncically good "DJ X" is, if "DJ X" plays the wrong music for the club he is DJ'ing in, he is not a good DJ. When I read comments that suggest people would rather hear a technicaly competent, beat-matched set, than a genre they don't like, I question the statement. Beat-matching, and set-building are all skills that a DJ should have, but aren't as important as song selection, which is what the biggest contention is at the moment. (song selection = genre).

I was highlighting this by reference to a well beat-matched R'n'B set not fitting in at Slime.

Finally, the reason I hate these sort of threads is because

i) They never achieve anything
ii) People always (whether innocently or willfully) misinterpret what other people have written
iii) They always descend in to personal insults.

:D
- this thread has been edited and re-edited to try and read as sensibly as possible to avoid any further misundertandings and I am certainly not trying to comment on anyone personally or get in to any personal arguments. :D

Unfortunately misunderstandings are easy on the internet due to the complete lack of inflection. I apologise for having a go at you.

Whilst it is nice to hear 'anthems' etc, my personal preference is to hear a well mixed set. I don't mind things going from 120bpm to 180bpm+ as long as it's gradually raised, it's the staccato jumps that I really can't stand. I don't expect to hear beat matching on the middle floor as the music down there is not meant to be beat matched... however, the top floor is totally different. The Dj's don't usually take requests (unless the track can be easily worked in) as they have sets planned out that they have worked on for a while and it's that fluency which really gets me going.

I don't like dancing to a great track, standing around for 30 seconds of mismatched rhythm and then dancing to another great track. It's just my opinion though. I was a professional club dancer in my younger years and maybe I have built up a certain level of elitism having been fortunate enough to see some of the greatest Dj's the world has to offer. I need consistency in a set otherwise it doesn't keep me interested.

[Silversurfer]

I have no idea what you're on about. :/

Dose this explain anything to you or is your motives of anther nature??
And before you jump to any conclusions I'm nobodys lilly pet.. ie when a DJ plays shite I have a go at them and they know this..
And as far as your ideas concerning the club...
What a bunch of bollocks!! Leave it alone to the ppl that have been running the club for over 20yrs+ so far..

My dear Byakhian...
You have just shown to me your narrow minded approach on this matter by not reading certain post properly through.. How sad!
Dwellems posted that thread (Slimelight DJ's/ TopFloor set..) here to give an up-date to how his downloads are going from month to month.. Read IT PROPERALLY and you will see that the amount of downloads of his recorded sets at slimes have been giving him inspiration to keep on playing that type of music.. it's a gauge and as I know him quite well he has no need to lie ether!

[Blink]

I don't like dancing to a great track, standing around for 30 seconds of mismatched rhythm and then dancing to another great track.

I agree with this, but I would rather dance to a great track, stand for 30 seconds of train wreck, then dance to another great track as opposed to dance to a great track, not like the next track, sit around for half an hour, then get bored and go to the other floor!!

I think we are both on the same page, just with different tastes in "great tracks".

[Dr_absinthe]

I think we are both on the same page, just with different tastes in "great tracks".

Sounds about right to me :D

[Byakhiam]

Nat, far more meaningful gauge than number of DLs is the number of people dancing to top floor sets from week to week. If there was a hundred people dancing Max's sets every Industek week, it'd be all good. But there isn't.

I know Max has no need to lie and I know he cares about Slimes. From what I've heard from his sets, they're some of the more interesting ones on the top floor, combining other elements like psytrance into the harsh noise elements.

And ultimately I have nothing against the existence of industek floor in principle. I am just saying that for the good of Slimelight and having the place busier with more people and new people, the industek floor is not the way forward. If there was a new third floor, smaller than the two floors, it could be a perfect way to sustain the industek floor for the people who like it. But at the moment taking over a floor that can hold upwards from three hundred people and playing music mainly appealing to a semi-regular group smaller than fifty in number, seems like a folly to me.

[SlimJim]

OK, an idea.

Recently, I think it was Antichrist, sent an online questionaire out to all it's Facebook or Myspace members. It was what type of music did you like and listed the different types played in all the different rooms. It also asked what is the type of music you would most like to hear.

I filled it in and when complete it let you see the answers given as a percentage. The most requested music was Goth Metal. Yuck!

Slimelight has a pretty large membership on Myspace, not sure about Facebook, so why not do something similar. Maybe even asking about non music improvements. Cheap, easy nothing to lose?

[Byakhiam]

I filled it in and when complete it let you see the answers given as a percentage. The most requested music was Goth Metal.

What did I say on the first post? :p

[SlimJim]

Yea but, hopefully the 1,500 Facebook and 2,700 Myspace members would come up with a different answer.

[Byakhiam]

Yea but, hopefully the 1,500 Facebook and 2,700 Myspace members would come up with a different answer.

You're just saying that because you don't personally like goth metal, right?

What did you answer for "what sort of music would you most want to hear?"

[ath]

If you were to instigate these changes then i can safely say that would be the last of me in slimes beyond major events.

if you wish to introduce goth metal on the goth floor that is fine but not at the expense of noise nights, w i would like to note that i know you dislike noise as a genre. furthermore i thought the point of slimes is we don't really want to hear the more commercial alternative such as goth metal

I would like to point out that the ebm floor does well every week, why the hell change a floor that always has a lot of people on it and poeple are largely happy with?

If anything all the industek floor needs is more of a crossover similar to what max does, more of other hard dance styles alongside the noise to try and bring in other people.

the problems as I see them with slimes music policy is as I see it

1) A complete lack of mixing, sometimes even on the industek floor, two awesome tracks sound even more awesome when you don't have to wait through a 30 sec train wreck and a less interesting track track is more bearable when you can dance into it and out of it. Almost every other electronic music style follows this basic principle except industrial, and it's not impossible to do using traktor for example i've managed it before and i was just messing around.

2) trying to please so many types of people, you have people like me who like noise industek and harsh ebm and thats about it when it comes to the music in slimes and the complete antithesis who wants goth and soft ebm, your never going to please both.

3) random progression of sets, why go from harsh ebm to Francesca's stuff then back, why not alter the dj times to allow a better progression between music styles.

and that is my two cents

[SlimJim]

Can't remember what the choices were, but probably Industrial, Electro or EBM.

Think it might also have been PureF*ckingIndustrial instead of Antichrist.

Just registered on the Club Antichrist site. Very good site, very customer orientated in wanting to know what the punters want. Completed a short survey and this is one of their answers -

"You wanted more Industrial, MORE Trad goth and Industrial metal. So we re-structured the rooms. More Goth on Feb 27th until 2am then Industrial metal and anthems, check the website for full DJ line ups. PFI re-launch with name DJs in on March 27th. April sees the launch of a NEW NEW room The HellHole - Old Skl Industrial, Guitar Industrial and Post Punk."

"You wanted heating (so did I for that matter!!)in the smoking area, the council wouldn't allow us (the buggers) but we will be getting throw over blankets to pass around to keep the Chill off. These arrive hopefully in time for March 27th's Party."


Interesting?

[Dr_absinthe]

You're just saying that because you don't personally like goth metal, right?"

You've just started an entire hate thread because you don't 'personally' like noise!

You are seriously starting to piss me off now Tapani. Your arguments are biased and unstructured and as soon as anyone challenges your opinion you skirt over their viewpoint and move on to the next post. Why don't you try responding to what people have said previously before you skip forward and try to childishly undermine other peoples opinions.

/Thread

[Byakhiam]

LOL.

If you read this as hate thread ... well, I can say tried to reason with you. :p

[BeElZeBabe]

I am utterly at a loss to see where the reason has come into your comments Byakhiam since most of the arguments you have raised are based solely on your personal music preference, and the opinions and tastes of other seem to have been nothing more than inconvenience to your plans.

[Dr_absinthe]

LOL.

If you read this as hate thread ... well, I can say tried to reason with you. :p

You've never tried to reason with me. You've thrown insults at me by calling me "arrogant" which I find quite amusing after reading the above quote. Step down from your pedestal and talk sensibly, maybe then people will listen to what you have to say.

It might serve you well to look over your previous posts as well. You start off being moderately coherent and then deviate to spouting pure vitriol. I have no time for such pathetic musings.

[Byakhiam]

Fine, I'll state it again, as many times as I need to:

1) The top floor could be playing Mongolian folk music and it'd have very little effect on my enjoyment of Slimelight, since I like about 90+% of the middle floor music and my only problem with that floor is that some songs get overplayed so much it's ridiclous. But that's a problem with the middle floor and it makes far more sense to try to affect the middle floor than the top floor.

2) I personally don't like industrial metal or gothic metal in significant quantities. I like the odd song and band here and there, but I'd much rather dance to electronic music.

...

The reason for this starting thread is that I see it as a bad thing for the club if one floor that could take in several hundred people consistently brings in less than a hundred.

If Slimelight has bottomless coffers, I'd expect the management to ignore this thread. But my experience in life indicates that bottomless coffers don't happen ... and if the management is worried about the current state of things, it'd make sense to try to give them IDEAS on how things COULD be improved. It's not like we have real power on affecting things here, it's just to voice our opinions.

...

And if you think there are better ideas than mine to improve Slimes, please say them out loud. The current way of things is slowly improving the attendance, but I feel my ideas could make things better by a lot. I could be wrong, but personally I think that trying and possibly failing is far better than just letting things be.

...

EDIT: Abs, I called you arrogant once, because you more-or-less grouped everyone who likes industrial/gothic metal into being 15-year old violent nu-metallers. And I said I'm sorry afterwards.

[BeElZeBabe]

1)As I have previously stated the music that is now played on the middle floor originated on the top floor… back in the days when the top floor was heaving with people. Which would be, in part, reason for the shift in people.

2)The DJ’s on the top floor work DAMN hard to give people new and old the best experience they can every time they play and despite your like or loath for the style of music deserve credit and appreciation for their efforts. Not constant negativity which degrades the whole system from within with new people coming in seeing the “regulars” in fighting and being unsupportive of DJ’s.
... and if the management is worried about the current state of things, it'd make sense to try to give them IDEAS on how things COULD be improved. It's not like we have real power on affecting things here, it's just to voice our opinions.


I will add that you may have hit the nail on the head with your last comment that I have quoted …. That is a huge IF you are toying with there If the management is worried…. Who exactly said they are? Since if they’re not then all this little effort is a futile exercise and waste of all our time.

[Dr_absinthe]

Fine, I'll state it again, as many times as I need to:

The top floor could be playing Mongolian folk music and it'd have very little effect on my enjoyment of Slimelight, since I like about 90+% of the middle floor music and my only problem with that floor is that some songs get overplayed so much it's ridiclous. But that's a problem with the middle floor and it makes far more sense to try to affect the middle floor than the top floor.

My Spider sense is telling me... you've never referred to that in this thread at all. All you've done is try to push your personal opinion on all of the users on this message board. You've done it before, you aren't doing it again.

I personally don't like industrial metal or gothic metal in significant quantities. I like the odd song and band here and there, but I'd much rather dance to electronic music.

Then when your ideas are implemented which club were you planning on visiting? Or were you just going to join in with the fickle masses and head to the next best thing?

EDIT: Abs, I called you arrogant once, because you more-or-less grouped everyone who likes industrial/gothic metal into being 15-year old violent nu-metallers. And I said I'm sorry afterwards.

Once is one time too many. Don't bandy around insults because you're intellectually outclassed (that's arrogance by the way).

TBC...

[Dr_absinthe]

The reason for this starting thread is that I see it as a bad thing for the club if one floor that could take in several hundred people consistently brings in less than a hundred.

If Slimelight has bottomless coffers, I'd expect the management to ignore this thread. But my experience in life indicates that bottomless coffers don't happen ... and if the management is worried about the current state of things, it'd make sense to try to give them IDEAS on how things COULD be improved. It's not like we have real power on affecting things here, it's just to voice our opinions..

Most of the people who have posted on this thread have said that the Industek floor is getting busier by the week. Should we give it a go and see if the numbers carry on increasing? No, we should try a completely untested format and just hope it works. Great business plan.

[Byakhiam]

1)As I have previously stated the music that is now played on the middle floor originated on the top floor… back in the days when the top floor was heaving with people. Which would be, in part, reason for the shift in people.

Exactly. With the key difference that in those times the middle floor was also busy with people. So the way I see it, two busy floors have been changed for one busy and one empty floor.

So somehow I see that things have gone wrong along the line somewhere.

Do you see it differently?

2)The DJ’s on the top floor work DAMN hard to give people new and old the best experience they can every time they play and despite your like or loath for the style of music deserve credit and appreciation for their efforts. Not constant negativity which degrades the whole system from within with new people coming in seeing the “regulars” in fighting and being unsupportive of DJ’s.

I know they are technically very good DJs. And I don't have anything against them in person either. In fact, I'd like to think of myself as being on friendly terms with Max.

But this thread isn't about bashing individual DJs. This thread is to point out the fact that the top floor really is not doing very well these days. And this is what I'm hoping something could be done about.

I will add that you may have hit the nail on the head with your last comment that I have quoted …. That is a huge IF you are toying with there If the management is worried…. Who exactly said they are? Since if they’re not then all this little effort is a futile exercise and waste of all our time.

I'm quite entitled to waste my time in any way I see fit.

--

And now for some genuine "vitriol" since you keep asking for it:

To be honest, I think this whole defensiviness from the part of noise people shows that you are afraid that the managament is worried and wants to do something ... and so you try to assure them that everything is the best it could be in the circumstances and that nothing should be done, because you're the ones standing to lose out the most.

If there would be less trad (and do note that my suggestions involve less trad in favour of newer gothic rock/metal and industrial rock/metal), the fanatical purist trads would just attend the other fairly numerous trad nights in London instead. And do note that there is nobody saying that trad should definitely remain on its current levels.

While there are very few if any noise nights at all around, because the number people attending them would be so miniscule that it wouldn't make commercial sense in anything bigger than a small pub. But instead of needing to go to a small pub, the noise purists have a whole floor of the premier gothic/industrial club in UK just to cater to their tastes.

I could remind you of the time when the industek floor turned from a weekly affair into a bi-weekly affair. Suddenly a lot of people turned up on the forums and said stuff in the vein of "What the hell!? Where's the noise gone?! This is going to be so bad!!" ... and funnily enough most of those people came to Slimes on average about once every two months. The whole noise movement is based on this, just like any extremist movement, that they rely on their members being so active that they can make up for their lack of numbers with that in comparison to the other "movements" whose members take a more carefree approach.

Personally I just find it a really sad state of affairs, because if the people liking EBM/futurepop/darkwave/etc actually made similar amounts of effort in making their opinion known, they'd swamp the noise lovers by far. But instead we've seen the top floor being changed from an EBM/techno/a bit of noise type of floor into an all night noise-fest, just by people demanding more noise over and over and over again.

...

Urgh .. rant over.

That's not really here or there though ... I just want to see Slimes having two busy floors again, people telling me in the morning how they had a great time in there and people telling me how much they look forward to Saturday for Slimes. So I can go out and have a good time feeling easy that Slimes is going to be there in a couple of years time as well as right now.

And from what I know of the scene, including modern gothic rock and industrial rock and also gothic metal and industrial metal (all of which used to get played in Slimes regularly even in 2005/2006 mind you) would be the most straight-forward solution in bringing in new people.

Other option would be to tap into the burlesque-synthpop-electro movement which seems to be gaining momentum these days, but the previous is more established option, so I think it's more likely to work. And I *personally* loathe this sort of "dirty synth-electro" sound. :D

In any case, *something* should be done so there will be a Slimelight in five years time too.

[SlimJim]

I think we need a bit of light relief ;) in this thread, so something from the AC forum, about Torture Garden

"AND....OMG, please don't wank on the dance floor....NOT nice!"

[CIW]

To be honest, I think this whole defensiviness from the part of noise people shows that you are afraid that the managament is worried and wants to do something ... and so you try to assure them that everything is the best it could be in the circumstances and that nothing should be done, because you're the ones standing to lose out the most.

pretty much the most dumbest thing I've read here in SL forums for a while now....

[Dr_absinthe]

I think we need a bit of light relief ;) in this thread, so something from the AC forum, about Torture Garden

"AND....OMG, please don't wank on the dance floor....NOT nice!"

I lol'd ^_^

[Dr_absinthe]

pretty much the most dumbest thing I've read here in SL forums for a while now....

I'm in total agreement.

[Byakhiam]

My Spider sense is telling me... you've never referred to that in this thread at all. All you've done is try to push your personal opinion on all of the users on this message board. You've done it before, you aren't doing it again.

Well, if I didn't mention it clearly before, I have put it there quite clearly now, and if you like, you may re-read my earlier posts with keeping that disclaimer in mind.

Then when your ideas are implemented which club were you planning on visiting? Or were you just going to join in with the fickle masses and head to the next best thing?

If my ideas would be implemented, EBM and other electronic industrial would remain, since they are actually popular sort of music. So I would still be perfectly happy with Slimelight, like a lot of other current regulars.

Once is one time too many. Don't bandy around insults because you're intellectually outclassed (that's arrogance by the way).

It's funny how you tell I shouldn't be insulting people at the same time you directly insult me. Hypocricy much?

Most of the people who have posted on this thread have said that the Industek floor is getting busier by the week. Should we give it a go and see if the numbers carry on increasing? No, we should try a completely untested format and just hope it works. Great business plan.

Far from completely untested, as gothic & industrial metal used to get played in Slimes quite regularly up to 2006/2007 when noise took over the top floor and EBM wholesale had to take refuge on the middle.

[DerOberst]

god now this thread is getting monotonous just like the other!! there seems to be a lot of stupid jingoism on here why cant we have a nice lovely thread:P
anyway I see all these posts about what music should be played where and when blah blah blah! And i am a serious genre snob so it kinda gets my goat!
top florr does not play NOISE!! it plays noiZE or power noize,or harsh techno not raw concrete ok francesca plays power electronics that is it!! as much as what i'd call ebm They dont play raw ebm on the middle floor unless a daf or 242,a split second or fla song is played
vnv or combichrist or covenant or shite like namnambelu or seabound are all futurepoop(if you like it groovy I dont) but i seriously remember the old days wher ALL genres were played and EVERYBODY was happy!! again the only dj who can rip it up is mak cos he can play such an electic mix of music it puts the lot of you to shame! While i beleive such bands as say rammstein have a place in slimes or the odd ministry track or the weird slayer remixes,goth or industrial metal is a big no no as much as gabber is in my book or fucking schranz or whatever stupid techno term is employed!!!!
at the end of the day you go to the club keep it alive by paying your money and buying drinks at the bar nuff said!!!!

[Dr_absinthe]

If my ideas would be implemented, EBM and other electronic industrial would remain, since they are actually popular sort of music. So I would still be perfectly happy with Slimelight, like a lot of other current regulars.

So you've now admitted that your viewpoint is completely biased. I haven't seen one 'regular' post in this thread who likes EBM, other than your dear self of course. Fine, people dance to it, I know that and the club knows that which is why the middle floor is not going to change from its current state... What gets me is why you would suggest different alternatives when the current format is working. One of the many reasons that you shouldn't be listened to.

It's funny how you tell I shouldn't be insulting people at the same time you directly insult me. Hypocricy much?

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/irony
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/hypocrisy (that one is just for the spelling)

lern2interwebz

Far from completely untested, as gothic & industrial metal used to get played in Slimes quite regularly up to 2006/2007 when noise took over the top floor and EBM wholesale had to take refuge on the middle.

I'm assuming you've used the term "wholesale" due to the generic nature of the music you're referring to. Ok, EBM moved downstairs, does that stop the floor being successful? No it doesn't, so why you've decided to use the word "refuge" is beyond me. Also please bear in mind that, even though I had a long absence, I was going to Slimelight before you could even spell it. What music was played on the 'middle' floor in the early to mid-nineties? Tell me three bands that were played back-to-back in a set. You can't. You have no idea how Slimes used to be so don't even start with quoting years and attendance figures, you're only going to make yourself look more idiotic than you already have.

[Guy13]

god now this thread is getting monotonous just like the other!! there seems to be a lot of stupid jingoism on here why cant we have a nice lovely thread:P


Especially for you...
http://img25.imageshack.us/img25/6804/kittenpictures54ct4.jpg
http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/7841/55346230pl0.jpg
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/1892/kittenfi5.jpg

[Byakhiam]

So you've now admitted that your viewpoint is completely biased. I haven't seen one 'regular' post in this thread who likes EBM, other than your dear self of course. Fine, people dance to it, I know that and the club knows that which is why the middle floor is not going to change from its current state... What gets me is why you would suggest different alternatives when the current format is working. One of the many reasons that you shouldn't be listened to.

I'm assuming you've used the term "wholesale" due to the generic nature of the music you're referring to. Ok, EBM moved downstairs, does that stop the floor being successful? No it doesn't, so why you've decided to use the word "refuge" is beyond me. Also please bear in mind that, even though I had a long absence, I was going to Slimelight before you could even spell it. What music was played on the 'middle' floor in the early to mid-nineties? Tell me three bands that were played back-to-back in a set. You can't. You have no idea how Slimes used to be so don't even start with quoting years and attendance figures, you're only going to make yourself look more idiotic than you already have.

I suggest you try putting your post together again without trying (and failing) to purposefully piss me off. :D

Though I'm curious, what else would you use to quantify people liking a particular sort of music at a club than them dancing to it?

[dwellems]

My gripe was directed at Guy13 but seeing that you joined in, then so be it..
Just some food for thought...DerOberst

[Dr_absinthe]

I suggest you try putting your post together again without trying (and failing) to purposefully piss me off. :D

Though I'm curious, what else would you use to quantify people liking a particular sort of music at a club than them dancing to it?

You're in way over your head Tapani. If that is the best response you can come up with then I genuinely pity you.

And in response to your post, I'd ask them, it's as simple as that.

[snoww_wwhite]

And this brings us to the actual ideas on how the overall music policy of Slimes could work better:

Two floor ideas:

Guitars vs Electronics:
- Floor 1, Guitar-driven floor: Trad goth, other gothic rock, industrial rock, industrial metal .. a bit like current trad floor, but having only 50% trad goth and then other 50% of music in style of the second point above
- Floor 2, Electronic floor: EBM, noise, synthpop, darkwave .. bit hard to make all work together, but going from Diary of Dreams to Terrorfakt is possible within a set if the DJ knows his music well enough
- Why it would work? Because guitar-driven music fits in together with other guitar-driven music far better than say industrial rock with electronic industrial like EBM or noise.

Gothic vs Industrial:
- Floor 1, Gothic floor: Trad goth, darkwave, synthpop, soft EBM, gothic metal .. basically any sort of music that identifies with "gothic" in mood while incorporating multiple styles that evoke that mood to keep the floor varied and fit in all sorts of music that make the scene
- Floor 2, Industrial floor: Harsh EBM, noise, industrial rock & metal, old school industrial .. basically any sort of music that identifies with "industrial" in mood while incorporating multiple styles that evoke that mood to keep the floor varied and fit in all sorts of music that make the scene
- Why it would work? If the DJs play varied sets that keep the atmosphere of the floor without playing any particular style of gothic / industrial too long (longer than a few songs in a row) and without doing too awkward jumps in styles, the music can flow together into a single consistent continuum. More challenging for the DJs than the previous option though.

Ideally however there would be three floors .. some ideas for it:

Guitars vs Soft Electronics vs Hard Electronics:
- Floor 1, Guitar-driven floor: Trad goth, other gothic rock, industrial rock, industrial metal .. a bit like current trad floor, but having only 50% trad goth and then other 50% of music in style of the second point above
- Floor 2, Soft electronic floor: Darkwave, synthpop, soft EBM .. basically anything from Cruxshadows and Diary of Dreams through Depeche Mode into VNV Nation
- Floor 3, Hard electronic floor: Harsh EBM, noise-EBM, noise .. basically anything harder electronic than VNV Nation
- Why it would work? It used to work before

Old vs New vs Established:
- Floor 1, Old School Floor: Trad goth, 80s, darkwave, old school industrial .. basically all sorts of music made before 1995 or so that appeal to scene veterans
- Floor 2, New School Floor: Industrial rock, industrial metal, gothic metal, new gothic rock .. basically a floor for current "mainstream" gothic/industrial music, but with also playing some old gothic and industrial rock classic bands (like NIN & Sisters) to allow people to cross over to floor 1, but also playing some Combichrist and other new music that is basically industrial rock/metal without guitars to allow people to cross over to floor 3
Floor 3, Established Floor: EBM, noise-EBM, noise .. basically current middle floor without any old school industrial or 80s, and including a bit more noise to compensate for taking out noise floor
- Why it would work? Because the music on floors 1 and 2 would work together through them being familiar to their target audiences and floor 3 keeping the old regulars happy (except for narrow-minded noise people)

Gothic vs Industrial vs Weekly Specials:
- Two floors essentially same as 2 floor Gothic vs Industrial, so I won't copy/paste that
- Third floor with a changing theme every week: 1 week old school industrial, 1 week trad goth, 1 week noise assault and 1 week whole night of EBM .... these as examples that I think could work and then obviously the other floors would need to adjust their music selection based on the special to avoid overlap
- Why it would work? It would directly fight against the "same thing every week" syndrome that plagues Slimelight and it would give all sorts of narrow-minded people their "ideal night" once a month .. also the same reasons as for two floor gothic vs industrial

A musical overhaul like any of the above would require some work though. First of all, incorporating "new school" industrial rock/metal and gothic metal would require new DJs to play it. And not any crappy Inferno DJs, but dynamic younger (below 40) people who are genuinely into those kinds of music. Vicky can probably play them too, but just one DJ isn't quite enough there. Otherwise the established DJs can probably play most of the genres listed .. except if the "monthly specials" are implemented, when guest DJs of those styles should be brought in to bring more variety. Secondly, a musical overhaul would need to be advertised properly. Especially if it is to target younger people who have not heard of Slimelight or have only heard how it is "used" to be. Word of mouth is fairly useful method of advertising, but relying solely on that is not really that practical today, especially when there are people around who use the same channels to spread anti-Slimelight sentiment to the scene.

* * *

Finally though and slightly contradicting the previous paragraph ... it would be an idea to regularly bring in guest DJs to play a set or two a night. A guest DJ would be likely to play a bit different sort of set than the regulars which would be good for variety. Also a guest DJ, who's got some name to him/herself would probably try to get all his/her mates to come down too. Also if it wouldn't seem like such an impossible prospect to play at Slimes, I'd expect the appeal of starting new goth/industrial club nights left and right would be significantly lesser. Ultimately, a guest DJ playing an hour or two is at worst an hour or two of bad music one Saturday, while the potential benefits could be significant.

* * *

Opinions? Feedback? Your own ideas?


thank fuck you do not make the music policy!


shame that the ones in charge are just as bad....

.... anyone noticed that i do not bother much anymore?


bad music is the cause of this. shame only for the rays of light and i can honestly say so far consistently impressive were Francesca and a lot of the time Steve Weeks.


i cannot remember how many weeks and months i went, only to discover that i am utterly bored by 3 AM.


shame about the club i went to for years and years... i think its 5 or 6 years in all and 4 of those every single saturday.


thats how bad it has become....

also sick of "educational" and failed rave DJs.

booooring!


does anyone go to a goth bunker to be "educated" or blasted by things you can listen to in better ventilated raves?

fuck it... might come and see the disaster zone again this weekend but do not expect me to part with my money unless there is a band on....

[CIW]

fuck it... might come and see the disaster zone again this weekend but do not expect me to part with my money unless there is a band on....

Saturday 28th Febuary
V2A + Northborne [club show. Doors 10pm]
www.myspace.com/northborne
www.v2a.co.uk

[Byakhiam]

You're in way over your head Tapani. If that is the best response you can come up with then I genuinely pity you.

And in response to your post, I'd ask them, it's as simple as that.

Nah, it's just too late for me to bother to make a proper response to someone who keeps calling me "idiotic" in every other post of his. :p

And I know a significant number of people who go to Slimes regularly and who like EBM. I also know people who used to go most weeks, but have cut down to just now and then because the music is too harsh.

However, people liking EBM often say that they don't post on these forums because of the attitude of the regalar posters. And looking at the sort of stuff that goes on in here, I can sympathise with them. :p

[snoww_wwhite]

Some thoughts from me, not a regular, ....

I also think Slimes may be missing something by not having a Goth Metal type night, as reading something like Kerrang, which is full of those bands, it looks like that's what the new/young goth types are listening to.

Ideas? Other than play what I like ;) I don't go often enough to say what should and shouldn't be played.


goth metal... jessus christ, slimelight was for a long time a sacntuary from that sort of stuff.



there are enough rave, techno, hard dance, trance, psytrance, drum and bass and metal nights in london.

[Dr_absinthe]

Nah, it's just too late for me to bother to make a proper response to someone who keeps calling me "idiotic" in every other post of his. :p

And I know a significant number of people who go to Slimes regularly and who like EBM. I also know people who used to go most weeks, but have cut down to just now and then because the music is too harsh.

However, people liking EBM often say that they don't post on these forums because of the attitude of the regalar posters. And looking at the sort of stuff that goes on in here, I can sympathise with them. :p

I was courteous enough to make an eloquent response to you after you insulted me. Evidently you haven't learned manners yet.

The only reason that regulars get annoyed is because trolls like you bring up threads like this every few months for no other reason than to piss people off. Whinge away as much as you like, just don't do it anywhere near anything Slimelight related. All you've done is bring down the club and you know it.

See you at Slimelight.

Doc.

[BeElZeBabe]

However, people liking EBM often say that they don't post on these forums because of the attitude of the regalar posters. And looking at the sort of stuff that goes on in here, I can sympathise with them. :p

I’d like to think that the music taste of an individual has nothing to do with whether or not they would receive a berating, only the content of their comments. As we all basically want the same thing we just have apparently very different ideas on how to achieve that.

[FallenPed]

I have to say you're not very specific on why they wouldn't work... ;)


I just don't like the insinuation that all guitar music goes well together and only together. As a guitarist, I view my instrument as being more versatile than that. The acoustic is very different from the electric, and amplifiers can create various different moods which when combined with vocals can create very different atmospherics.

Based upon some of the posts in this thread referencing Goth Metal (though I don't know what that means - unless it means Type O Negative etc...), I would expect that it wouldn't mix particularly well with Bauhaus or Joy Division, in musical style or in the people in the room.

However, if you want more people to mingle between the floors, then perhaps this is a way forward - though I would end up spending more time on stairs than on either dancefloor, until my pilates trainer tells me to stop stair-stepping and sit down.

[FallenPed]

Especially for you...


Cut out pictures, but I think that this is my favourite post of the week though not intended for me. I do think somewhat undone by your signature file.

Save the Piglet, where is the Goth-Tigger when you need him.

[snoww_wwhite]

Nah, it's just too late for me to bother to make a proper response to someone who keeps calling me "idiotic" in every other post of his. :p

And I know a significant number of people who go to Slimes regularly and who like EBM. I also know people who used to go most weeks, but have cut down to just now and then because the music is too harsh.

However, people liking EBM often say that they don't post on these forums because of the attitude of the regalar posters. And looking at the sort of stuff that goes on in here, I can sympathise with them. :p


and some who are bored with noisey techno and endless loops of covenant and vnv.

some of the "DJ" of slimelight do not change their basic playlist, i was at the point where i could fortell what track simon would play next... i think he got that playlist from somebody else... i dont want to name more names but he is just as bad.

the ego of some of them i incredible and while there was a time when one could go away and go to another floor, we are now facing endless loops of sisters of mercy instead if we cannot handle Tiga or Moby or the prodigy etc.


the reason why you might be called an "idiot" is because you think you know the answer but you do not...


but having some trendy club on the bottom floor might be a good thing cos we might be inheriting a great dancefloor eventually... but when?


btw oldschool ebm is not dead ... not at all

[snoww_wwhite]

1)As I have previously stated the music that is now played on the middle floor originated on the top floor… back in the days when the top floor was heaving with people. Which would be, in part, reason for the shift in people.

no, we just got bored of bad choices... after all, i would go to fabric if i was into techno




2)The DJ’s on the top floor work DAMN hard to give people new and old the best experience they can every time they play and despite your like or loath for the style of music deserve credit and appreciation for their efforts. Not constant negativity which degrades the whole system from within with new people coming in seeing the “regulars” in fighting and being unsupportive of DJ’s.




LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLO LOLOLOLOL

this is the funniest i have heard for a long time!!!!!!!!!

what about me working hard in order to have self loving DJs play shit at me?

hey why pay to get there, get in, get an outfit, buy drinks and then hear that we are oh so ungreatful?


hell yeah, i am ungreatful to DJs who are a lot less than hard working because they are on some kind of shitty ego trip....


i pay the money, i want slimelight to deliver what it promises... i think i quote this for many many many years.... industrial (not metal Bayakam!) ebm, goth and cross over... not techno, rave or drum and bass


LOLOLOLOLOL


you are so funny!

[BeElZeBabe]

You are of course entitled to your opinion as everyone is personally I don’t agree, I like the music on the top floor, it’s all a matter of taste in the end. I am yet to speak to any one who works at slimes that has been arrogant or on any form of ego trip, maybe I’m just lucky. But I would have no hesitation to make that point if I had had such an experience, as if a bad set is played I have no hesitation in making my self heard on the matter.

[snoww_wwhite]

Far from completely untested, as gothic & industrial metal used to get played in Slimes quite regularly up to 2006/2007 when noise took over the top floor and EBM wholesale had to take refuge on the middle.


you what?

come again...


i have been to slimelight before 2006/2007 and metal was never a part of it unless some git played it, which quite suddenly caused a BIG row!

when you turned up we had rythmic noise nights regularly, all night and it kept the dance floor busy... then people decided after a year or so that only banging beats without significant melodies is a bit too repettitive and samey... so the call for other stuff came up once again...


and once again mister, could you inform yourself a bit more, industrial is NOT fucking metal


which is why the term "idiot" might come up here and there to label your level of ignorance

[snoww_wwhite]

You are of course entitled to your opinion as everyone is personally I don’t agree, I like the music on the top floor, it’s all a matter of taste in the end. I am yet to speak to any one who works at slimes that has been arrogant or on any form of ego trip, maybe I’m just lucky. But I would have no hesitation to make that point if I had had such an experience, as if a bad set is played I have no hesitation in making my self heard on the matter.


you are totally entitled to like what you like dear, though it has been seen that a lot of people buggered off and did not consider returning to the top floor because after a couple of years it just gets tedious.


hence the call for DJs to finally make an effort to mix up the music and to get a grip on what is rythmic noise, what is power electronics, whats industrial and what is old school ebm.

all quite suitable to alternate ... honestly we could both start to like bits of the top floor music that way.


as for arrogant and on ego trip... i can name at least 4 (former) and 1 current one who i would call just that... i guess ego trip could be substituted with "clueless"

[snoww_wwhite]

Cut out pictures, but I think that this is my favourite post of the week though not intended for me. I do think somewhat undone by your signature file.

Save the Piglet, where is the Goth-Tigger when you need him.


i used to fill whole threads with LOTS of pictures....


it was quite entertaining but i havent got enough time these days....


http://www.darkfurr.co.uk/archive/m-tigger.jpg

[BeElZeBabe]

I will happily agree that variety is a good thing, I like many styles of music and will happily dance to just about anything with a beat I freely admit that, I know for a fact that certain DJ’s are spending a lot of time hunting new music, talking to people and will listen to constructive feed back. Many times a few of them have walked down the steps to me shaking my head at them lol. And then going on to explain … often in length and great detail which bits I liked and which I didn’t.
What kind of bands where you after hearing? Out of my own interest in expanding my music library :D
And clueless … now that I will agree with …. For certain people anyway ;) lol

[snoww_wwhite]

I will happily agree that variety is a good thing, I like many styles of music and will happily dance to just about anything with a beat I freely admit that, I know for a fact that certain DJ’s are spending a lot of time hunting new music, talking to people and will listen to constructive feed back. Many times a few of them have walked down the steps to me shaking my head at them lol. And then going on to explain … often in length and great detail which bits I liked and which I didn’t.
What kind of bands where you after hearing? Out of my own interest in expanding my music library :D
And clueless … now that I will agree with …. For certain people anyway ;) lol


i will come back with a lengthy reply... need to go to bed.. work demands it

[BeElZeBabe]

Please do, and I should really do the same.

[DerOberst]

My gripe was directed at Guy13 but seeing that you joined in, then so be it..
Just some food for thought...DerOberst




Lol! I'm not gonna get invovlved in a langing match with you feller:P
My gripes are directed at specific djs of which you are not on the list!!

[Blink]

Finally, the reason I hate these sort of threads is because

i) They never achieve anything
ii) People always (whether innocently or willfully) misinterpret what other people have written
iii) They always descend in to personal insults.


Oh, and I may or may not like NIN/Seabound/Covenant

[batfink]

I complain to the DJ (except not to Mak) every time Delirium is played ... and it's requested by a number of people every week.



I think most of that is down to one person who used to request it every sodding week (don't worry, words have been had!) and it's just transgressed into one of those things that gets played by everyone at some point. Personally I'll join you in digging the hole to bury it in.

...gothic/industrial rock/metal...

I promise to say something sensible when i'm not at work. And i do like the odd bit of metal. But this islargely going to consist of cock, isn't it?

[CIW]

the new target audience
http://www.metro.co.uk/vampfashion

[DerOberst]

I think most of that is down to one person who used to request it every sodding week (don't worry, words have been had!) and it's just transgressed into one of those things that gets played by everyone at some point. Personally I'll join you in digging the hole to bury it in.



I promise to say something sensible when i'm not at work. And i do like the odd bit of metal. But this islargely going to consist of cock, isn't it?

Lol you said cock(insert bevis and butthead laugh)
:)

[snoww_wwhite]

I will happily agree that variety is a good thing, I like many styles of music and will happily dance to just about anything with a beat I freely admit that, I know for a fact that certain DJ’s are spending a lot of time hunting new music, talking to people and will listen to constructive feed back. Many times a few of them have walked down the steps to me shaking my head at them lol. And then going on to explain … often in length and great detail which bits I liked and which I didn’t.
What kind of bands where you after hearing? Out of my own interest in expanding my music library :D
And clueless … now that I will agree with …. For certain people anyway ;) lol


right, i promised it and here it is:

Playlist just for fun and for no purpose including enough styles to keep a few people happy.
Like a good bride, something old, something new, something borrowed and something blue.

oh yeah and i smuggled a track of mine in there too.

happy reading, if you want to play this anytime, please let me know and i shall turn up at slimelight even if there is no band on.


here it comes:


Haus Arafna - Signed With Blood
SPK - Wars Of Islam
YelworC - Dark Thorn
Wumpscut - Stillbirth
Leather Strip - The Shame Of A Nation
Der Blutharsch - XI (Time Is Thee Enemy [In The Hands Of The Master])
Von Thronstahl - Bellum Sacrum Bellum
Deniere Volunte - La Nuit Revient
Feindflug - Disappointment Overdose
Dupond - Casino
Ad:Key - Hoch die Hammer (Erzbergwerk Mix)
Pouppee Fabrikk - Elite Electronics
Spetsnatz - Reign Of Wolves
Nitzer Ebb - Murderous
Die Form - Hertz Frequenz
Tyske Ludder - Thetanen
Die Krupps - Wahre Arbeit Wahrer Lohn
T.A.N.K. - Run Human Run
Klinik -Moving Hands
This Morn Omina - SP
Dulce Liquido - Serial Killer
Collapsing Systems - Sozialstorung
Punch Inc - Desert Storm
Xotox - Dunkelheit
Converter - Monster
Standgericht - Vodka
Sonar - Hostage
Dive - So Hard
Clock DVA - De-Cyphered
Sturm Cafe - Stiefel Fabrik
Kommando XY - Genesis
Elite! - Harte Liebe
DAF - Kebab Traume
A;grumh - Ayatollah Jackson
ADAC 8286 - Commercial Bitches
Feldwerkstatt - Volle Deckung (Stahlwerk AG remix)
Hocico - Fed up
Rabia Sorda - Save Me From My Curse