Sense of community?

[Byakhiam]

Some of the bits in the Music Was Awesome This Week thread these past two days had me wondering ....

Why are alternative people so divisive? They're almost as bad as socialists in this regard, starting new movements on smallest differences of opinion and often disliking all the other branches.

Well, not always, but you know what I mean:
Trad goths calling anything electronic "bleepy shit".
Old school people calling new music "ibiza goth".
Goths calling cybers "candy ravers".
Noise people calling softer music "gayBM".
Industrial people making fun of goths "screwing in lightbulbs".
And it just goes on ...

While we're still part of the same scene and share a lot of the same ideas. Obviously in today's world, very few people belong strictly to just one scene. Especially among the younger crowd. So, why try to put people into boxes and refuse anything different?

There are a lot of nice people going to Slimes these days, if you make the effort of getting to know them, rather than expecting automatic respect for whatever reason. But nobody likes being patronized or judged by their appearance. Not even goths. :p

[DerOberst]

Some of the bits in the Music Was Awesome This Week thread these past two days had me wondering ....

Why are alternative people so divisive? They're almost as bad as socialists in this regard, starting new movements on smallest differences of opinion and often disliking all the other branches.

Well, not always, but you know what I mean:
Trad goths calling anything electronic "bleepy shit".
Old school people calling new music "ibiza goth".
Goths calling cybers "candy ravers".
Noise people calling softer music "gayBM".
Industrial people making fun of goths "screwing in lightbulbs".
And it just goes on ...

While we're still part of the same scene and share a lot of the same ideas. Obviously in today's world, very few people belong strictly to just one scene. Especially among the younger crowd. So, why try to put people into boxes and refuse anything different?

There are a lot of nice people going to Slimes these days, if you make the effort of getting to know them, rather than expecting automatic respect for whatever reason. But nobody likes being patronized or judged by their appearance. Not even goths. :p

Because it's always that way my jung friend:) when I was a young gothling waay back in the early eighties the punks took the piss out of us!!!
The so called alternative has always been a big big lie!! look at the way camden has changed a weird hybrid of rockabilly and emo!(a lot of these people moan about chavs YET most emos look like one another and listen to the same music so therefore they are chavs)
I hold no spite for nobody(well the certain exception)The english scene has always been like this(bitchiness behind your back)I guess for me the whole so called fucked up generation doesnt and never did appeal to me! When you get bands like comedychrist flirting with images of syringes and pills and people saying druqs it kinda puts me off the whole alternative scene:(
yes of course nice people go to slimes you yourself are one of those but you gotta admit there are a LOT of ashats!!!Whn you get to my age you kinda get jaded with it all!!
I like goths always have was one myself and I'm damn PROUD of that as anyone else should be!!! As I stated on a previous post I was at the ice cold festival in germany and the friendship and warmth from the goth crowd was so warm that it made me smile a looot(ang on I'm a misrerable bastard) as for respect well I try to show people the upmost respect whenever I'm in slimes(ask oz or fad or loki) but beleive me I have had that thrown in my face by certain cretins who have gon there:(
time will tell my jungling whether we can pull together!!!

[SP]

We're not all like that. I pretty much like everything ... Goth, Industrial, EBM, old, new, and a bit of everything in between!

Having said that, people will always gather in their little "clans", and have a little dig at others ... it's the way of the world.

PS. It was good to chat with you last weekend Byakhiam!! ;)

[Antagonist]

I like treating everyone with suspicion. Time will prove me right.

[Alexander]

I've used all of the above phrases before (albeit the GayBM is a new one on me), so I guess I'm all of them, or none of them.

I've always made an effort to get to know new people though, I've always seen that as an important aspect of Slimelight.

So I'm not really sure what I am, other than naughty.

I think it's more of an English thing to be honest; sarcasm, irony and all that.

[FallenPed]

Why are alternative people so divisive? They're almost as bad as socialists in this regard, starting new movements on smallest differences of opinion and often disliking all the other branches.


Perhaps, because they are trying desperately hard to be alternative - as if exclusivity brings cool. Desperately trying to be the first to discover the next big thing so that they can be like a Maclaren fame for discovering others fame so as to justify their own opinions.

I'm as bad as anyone, getting bored of things when they become common.

Then again, most of the thread arguments these days are based on people stating that they need a pigeon-hole in order to inflict their own music on everyone else. But, what do I know as I flitter from room to room seeking inspiration.

I only hold one rule, which is that if a DJ would even think of playing a request from me then they should never be allowed to DJ again.

Some days I'm a trad-goth, some hours I'm a gabbatech. some minutes I'm a cyberBM, some seconds a punk but most of the time I'm a...

[Antagonist]

People will always catagorise what's around them, that's just human nature. Although once you're aware of that it can be helpful to see how that which seems to be similar is actually infinitely different. Maybe there's an infinite number of ways to catagorise anything.

However, once you are able to catagorise yourself as in "i am a ... " in too brief a sentence, then you're in trouble. And probably need to become more interesting.

But then I is just a cyber-rivet-goth-electro-angry-poet-raver....

[Blink]

However, once you are able to catagorise yourself as in "i am a ... " in too brief a sentence, then you're in trouble. And probably need to become more interesting.


Or you could have reached a Zen-like plane of clarity

I am......me :cool:

[batfink]

Some of the bits in the Music Was Awesome This Week thread these past two days had me wondering ....

Why are alternative people so divisive? They're almost as bad as socialists in this regard, starting new movements on smallest differences of opinion and often disliking all the other branches.



Because they are human and therefore flawed, just like everyone else.

[industrialwarrior]

People like to see themselves and what they like in their own little corner of the alternative scene as "the best" and the rest of it is "crap".

I'm not too fond of Goth music. I don't hate it; I like a small bit of it but would not label myself as ""Goth". While I choose not to listen to it, I will not disrespect those who do. It is their choice. I feel that as long as I give fans of the other 'sub-genres' the respect they are due, I deserve some back.

To me, bands like Tactical Sekt and Terrorfakt are the best in their fields but that is just my personal view; ther are plenty who will disagree because everyone has their own view and the right to their own opinion. It is simply a case of accepting each others' differences within our already small 'scene'.

[Byakhiam]

Some pretty good input there, and I have to say I agree with quite a few points there...

Especially about alternative people going away from the "common". I've been doing that too a fair bit (though I'm quite less worse with it now than before ... ). But at the same time, it's rather pretentious to actually look down on something "common". Wouldn't it be so much more constructive to tell people liking more "common" music / style / anything about more interesting alternatives? People need to find out about stuff somehow and looking down on the "Rammstein kid" because he "doesn't know better" is not likely to bring him to a better direction .. while recommending some Combichrist to him just might.

And to counter the expected swipe at Combichrist here ... not everyone likes it, but I seriously think it's good for the scene to have bands that are "mainstream" enough to have appeal across the scene and even beyond the scene. It's this kind of bands that bring in new people to the scene, not the most experimental stuff you can find.

Especially nowadays when the idea of people outside the scene of what exactly are gothic and industrial musics like is almost completely separated of what you would hear in gothic or industrial club nights. Well, okay, I'm exaggerating a bit here ... but in general the situation is a little bit like having goth clubs in the 80s, where they wouldn't play any Sisters of Mercy at all...

...

Maybe what I'm saying is that even if we all have individual highly defined tastes and can categorise everyone else into small boxes ... definitely different boxes than we are in too ... we should rather embrace the diversity of the other parts of scene that we are not ourselves in, than look down on them?

...

PS. Yeah, SP, was good to talk to you the other week. :)

[ineversaidthat]

Why are alternative people so divisive?
simple answer: they're so used to disagreeing with everyone else[normal people] on matters of taste that it's become ingrained behaviour

[Icicle]

Mentioning the sense of community: what happened to S.O.P.H.I.E. event? Did I miss it? Did we get united around something that might concern us all and actually acted upon it?

[Stoo]

For me 'alternative' is purely fashion and music, I coincidentally am quite fond of 'cyber' clothing and electronica so I suppose that's my area but I don't go around calling myself 'a cyber' like some do.

I think the issue is that a lot of people seem to think that goth culture has some sort of lifestyle choice with it. A 'state of mind'. Perhaps I simply do not have this mental state, but to me goth culture is simply a grouping of people of shared interest. A shared interest in entertainment - music, books and the social circles they have.

Most of the goths I have met have not at all seemed depressed.

So! My point is that a lifestyle choice surely goes beyond simply fashion and entertainment, and therefore goth is not a lifestyle choice (or if it is, then perhaps your need to expand your horizons beyond your taste in entertainment and fashion).

And therefore perhaps a lot of people need to stop taking themselves so seriously in Slimelight?

Yes, for a large proportion of us folk who haven't been going since '87 alternative is a 'phase', but you cannot tar everyone with the same brush. I have been going to Slimelight for quite a few years now and I know some 'cybers' who have been going for longer. There will always be the kids who are there just because goth is cool and they will most likely look cyber but it is unfair to judge them.

On the other hand I cannot defend many of the 'cyber kids' as a lot of them are arrogant and superficial because they are able to have an extreme look because they are living at home or are students (and therefore don't need a real job).

There are enough narrow minded people in the world to give us pathetic comments for our dress sense and music taste, without us doing it to each other.

[snoww_wwhite]

we have been slagging everyone off since the dawn of sheep.

why stop when it gives us a false sense of superiority?

are you so daft to not realise that i am far supreme than you?

i shall stomp you with my polished combat boot... or i might not if its too much hassle ;-)